A rocky few weeks for the Democrats culminated in Sunday’s extraordinary statement from President Joe Biden, announcing an end to his candidacy. , As he did so, he made space for the next generation of Democratic leaders, endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris to head the ticket. As the dust settles, former Senator Claire McCaskill and former White House Communications Director Jennifer Palmieri react to the president’s decision, and take stock of what’s next after Harris announced her intent to run and bring the party together to win.
Note: this is a rough transcript. Please excuse any typos.
Jennifer Palmieri: Hello, welcome to “How to Win 2024.” It’s Monday, July 22, about 9:00 a.m. on the East Coast. I’m Jennifer Palmieri, and I’m back here on a Monday with my co-pilot, Claire McCaskill. Oh my God, Claire.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, it’s really been something. We’re going to take a little time to talk about Joe Biden and how wonderful he is. But I just want to say, even though this has been an emotional roller coaster, I feel really blessed that I’ve had a front row seat. As somebody who loves politics and who is a major in political science, these are incredible times to live in. And —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — you know, I don’t know how all this is going to turn out, but, you know, I’m buckled in now and I’m ready for a wild ride because, you know, the first two loops on the roller coaster —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — are so big, but then it builds to the great big one at the end.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yes.
Claire McCaskill: I’m ready for the great big one. And I think it’s going to feel great getting to the top and fun sliding down the other way after we beat Donald Trump.
Jennifer Palmieri: Oh, I mean, yeah, that part of the roller coaster, I’m all down for. It is not even Labor Day, you know, because I know Labor Day is where you really buckle in to say like, okay, we’re inching up on the roller coaster and this is where it’s going to get crazy. But when we last spoke on this podcast on Friday, all eyes were on President Joe Biden and whether he’d decide to leave the race or stay in amid the deafening calls to rethink his candidacy.
Claire McCaskill: And Sunday, yesterday, we all bore witness to this important next chapter of history. The president released a letter mid-afternoon announcing that, quote, “It has been the greatest honor of my life to serve as your president. And while it has been my intention to seek reelection, I believe it is in the best interests of my party and the country for me to stand down and focus entirely on fulfilling my duties as president for the remainder of my term.”
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah, I mean, it was stunning, right? Plus, I had talked to a lot of people at the White House on Saturday just to check in with you because I know how it is when you’re totally under siege and like all of a sudden all of your friends and all the people who wanted things for you for the last three and a half years just ghost you, right? So I wanted to check in and see how everybody was doing. And I don’t think people were misrepresenting the situation to me. I really think they thought there was no decision. He can’t speak. You know, he’s in Rehoboth. He’s recovering.
People should not expect anything soon. I hope things get resolved one way or another. But there was no sense of certainty that this was going to come down on Sunday. And it didn’t even occur to me that the president could put out a piece of paper announcing this as opposed to doing a real statement. But let’s talk about why he felt the need to just go ahead and do it. I know Steve Ricchetti is really close aide, good friend of mine, I think a friend of yours too, Mike Donilon, been with him for decades and had them come to Rehoboth and talk this all through with them.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, on Saturday night. And I think the other thing that happened was there was internal polling that was done in the campaign. And I think that Ricchetti and Donilon had that data for the president on Saturday night and showed him in stark terms what was happening in the battleground states. Because there really are two races that are run, as you know very, very well, Jen. One is, yes, you want to get every vote in every state, but you have to get to 270 electoral votes. So the battleground states become dominant, especially in the closing months of the campaign. And I think when the president saw that not only had he had significant slippage with a large delta between the Senate candidates and his presidency on the ballot in the battleground states, that he was losing significant ground in states that we had considered safe —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — like New Jersey, like New Mexico, like Minnesota —
Jennifer Palmieri: Virginia, yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — like Virginia, like Colorado. These had gone from purplish-tinged to blue, really, since Barack Obama. And the fact that they were in play, I think that the culmination of all that data is what really showed him in very stark terms that what he had said, if he was shown that he could not win, he would stand aside. And I think that data told him that he could not win and so he did just that.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah. And the three of them sat up and wrote this letter. And just imagine how emotional that must have been for the three of them. You know, I always think in literary terms and I’m like, oh, that would be an incredible play, just that discussion, you know. And it’s something more symbolic than just a president stepping aside in this race. It is that generation, you know, the very beginning to the baby boomer generation, an older white man, being what he said he was going to be, the transition to a new generation. And not just giving way to a new candidate, giving way to a new generation, you know, a woman, a woman of color.
As it feels the same way as you do, Claire, it’s a very big moment in American history and I feel lucky that we get to. I mean, some days I’m like, why do we have to live through all of this? But it is a remarkable thing to see. And I am proud of our party that unlike the Republican Party, not that there’s any comparison in any universe between Joe Biden’s, situation that he’s dealing with and Donald Trump, but still, we had a leader that was not up to the job and our party rose to the occasion and did something about it and had a leader who was, you know, was a true patriot and put his own concerns about his own future. And then even his legacy, although his legacy, I think, you know, has really been buoyed by this to do the right thing.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, I think his legacy will be legend in the history books at this point.
Jennifer Palmieri: Legend.
Claire McCaskill: It will be legend.
Jennifer Palmieri: I mean, the vice president to the first black president, the president that picked a black woman as his vice president and then accomplished so much and then step aside. I mean, he’s going to be this incredible figure.
Claire McCaskill: Yes. And I was proud of the fact that everyone, especially the leadership, took a day to not focus on the vice president, that most people that I watched on television and most of the statements I read and most of the traffic on social media was all about Joe Biden yesterday —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — which is appropriate.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: It is appropriate. You know, I know, Jen, that a lot of us who reported accurately on what we saw at the debate have taken in a lot of negativity from a lot of Democrats who felt that we were being unfair to the president. I completely understand. I don’t discount those feelings and I get it.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: It was not easy. It was really hard. But I do think it’s really important for people to realize that age was always an issue for Joe Biden.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: The debate didn’t make it an issue. It always registered in the polls. And the way that Joe Biden had to overcome that was with performance.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: It was his only path to the presidency for another four years, was to overcome the concerns that voters, not necessarily the voters that are all in living on X or Insta or any of the other TikTok, but for a whole lot of Americans, it was a wait and see.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: And the debate crystallized those concerns in a way that really impacted how people were responding on polls and ultimately, I believe that was the tipping point. For those people who say accurately talking about an obvious problem in our presidential candidate is what caused this, then I got to tell you, maybe they need to think about that because what our party did was 180 degrees from what the Republican Party has done.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: The Republican Party has looked at unbelievable disqualifying flaws in a very messed up man and said, yeah, that’s our guy. Yeah, no —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — he’s a felon. No, he’s a serial adulterer.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: They’re all in.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: And I’m proud that our party had the courage to step up and talk about the obvious. And I’m even more proud, so proud that we elected Joe Biden in the first place —
Jennifer Palmieri: I know.
Claire McCaskill: — because there aren’t very many leaders that would have done what he did for his country.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah. So, another thing I want to say is Jill Biden has come under a lot of criticism that I think has been unfair in the last few weeks. You know, this is something that happens. People don’t like what’s happening and they blame the wife. And her communications director put out a statement on her behalf last night that I think gave us a sense of what was really going on. Down to the last hours of the decision only he could make, she was supportive of whatever road he chose. She’s his biggest believer, champion, and always on his side. And that trusted way only a spouse of almost 50 years can be. She’s just been like a huge and she’ll continue to be a huge benefit, I think, campaigning, but just like an incredible support of an incredible first lady. So what do you think about Biden going forward, Claire, and what he can do in the campaign?
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, really essential. You know, I think this is the way it’s going to game out. I think you’re going to see more and more people endorsing Kamala Harris and you’re going to see more and more delegations. A lot of them are meeting today. Some are meeting tomorrow. I think she will quickly amass the number of delegates she needs for the nomination. Then they’ve got to figure out how do you intersect needing to introduce her to the country with a biography and actually nominating her. But make no mistake about it. Joe Biden is going to be very important at the Democratic National Convention, celebrating him, honoring him, giving him the love and affection that we all feel for him, and also him signaling to the country the reasons why he selected Kamala Harris in the first place.
Jennifer Palmieri: Right.
Claire McCaskill: He had a lot of choices for vice president. There were many that he could have chosen. And she is the one that got the nod. And I think he is very important in the campaign, really to build enthusiasm in the Democratic base. I don’t think he helps with that last two percent that we need in those battleground states.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: But frankly, right now, Jen, I do believe this race is turnout, turnout, turnout. I think it is getting our folks out. And that’s why this change at this moment has really injected jet fuel into what I believe will be one of the most robust turnout operations that our party has ever seen.
Jennifer Palmieri: Right. One thing I would note that I think was probably was really effective and understanding humans file in the back of their mind, the Clintons and how they handled this, okay. You know, I think everyone played their role here. Obama put his one statement out saying I have his back. And then he stepped back, right. He didn’t say more. The Clintons continued to make phone calls to donors throughout this process saying you need to continue to give to Joe. They were supportive behind the scenes and calls that they gave to Joe. Sometimes, you know, you need all of these things. You need people pushing him to do the right thing. But you also need people that just have your back, right. And I feel like that probably helped, too.
But let’s explain like kind of what’s going on behind the scenes. I think some people are like, how can Barack Obama not endorse or why is Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries still saying there should be an open process? And I think that, first of all, there’s no mechanism by which there’s not an open process. The vice president will have to in some form go before the delegates and be nominated as the next nominee. And that is an open process and other people can decide to run if they want to. So far, no one has. But I think what these leaders are trying to do is make sure that that people understand that there’s integrity to this process. There’s this thing like, oh, she can’t just be anointed that she’s earned it, not that she hasn’t earned it by virtue of 14 million votes that she has gotten in the Democratic primary as part of the running mate, as being the running mate, as being the vice president, as being the best prepared for the job. But these leaders are making space. And I think it’s smart.
You know, this is a high class problem she has now, having so many endorsements. But these leaders are stepping back for now to let there be a process that has legitimacy to show that unlike, you know, rigged elections on other sides, that there is a process here by which she will earn the nomination and that’s why those leaders are holding back. And I think that assuming that this continues to go on the path that we are on, they will come and endorse her at the at the right time. You do want to stage these things.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, I mean, they didn’t want the appearance of this being shoved down anybody’s throats and they wanted it to happen organically and now it has. And it will continue to happen that way and they will endorse not as the first, but as well, some of the last, and that’s great. And I do think it’s important to remember, this is not a coronation. It’s the Constitution. A vice president is selected for the reason that there would be someone to step in if for any reason the president steps aside. That is exactly what is happening here. So we’re going to take a quick break here. When we get back, we’re going to look at what’s next after President Biden endorsed Kamala Harris to be the Democratic nominee for president of the United States. Back in a moment.
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Claire McCaskill: Welcome back. Soon after Biden released his statement withdrawing himself from the race, he released another endorsing his Vice President Kamala Harris as the nominee. Let’s take a moment to review what happened subsequently. First, she said, I’m honored —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — to have his endorsement. And it is her intention to earn and win this nomination.
Jennifer Palmieri: Right.
Claire McCaskill: That is the first thing that happened. She led with earn. Smart.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yep.
Claire McCaskill: And then she basically spent all day on the phone.
Jennifer Palmieri: Right.
Claire McCaskill: I think she called 100 people, literally, yesterday.
Jennifer Palmieri: Oh, my gosh. Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: And that’s a lot as somebody who’s had to do call time. A hundred is a lot, especially since you have to keep your energy level up.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: You have to face every phone call like the first phone call you made.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: You have to listen. You can’t cut people off. And you have to say the same things over and over again.
Jennifer Palmieri: Right.
Claire McCaskill: I don’t think people understand how exhausting that can be. So, she’s already showing a work ethic that she will need to draw upon in the next hundred and what is it, 102 days now, 101?
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah, I think so.
Claire McCaskill: It’s close.
Jennifer Palmieri: It’s like, yeah. Yeah, next Sunday, I know is 100 days because you and I have to do some sort of special, as I recall, so.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah. Next Sunday is 100 days.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah. I even talked to people who had voicemails from her. It’s like, yeah, so she was busy doing all that. It is interesting. The president put his statement out. He thanked the vice president in his original statement for her patience, her support. And I was like, oh, wow, he’s not endorsing her. And then, you know, it’s like maybe 20 minutes later, half hour later, you know, which I think is smart, like stage these things. And then said, you know, separate and apart from that decision, I have made the decision to endorse her. And then, you know, those next 12 hours were super important and she just like, wow, did she lock down a ton of support. By the way, every single state party chair has endorsed her in the party, all 50. That’s different than every delegation. But every state party chair has endorsed her. Clyburn, the Congressional Black Caucus, the Clintons, Senator Warren, the SEIU, the Farm Workers Union —
Claire McCaskill: AFT.
Jennifer Palmieri: –AFT. So, a ton of support behind her. No rumblings of anybody getting in. Oh, my God. Joe Manchin raised his head for a brief moment to say that maybe, I mean, I was like, oh, my gosh, do it. That’s like such a favor to her. Go ahead. Change your party registration back to Democrats and try to challenge her. That would be helpful to her. But then I think this morning he was on CBS and he said that he wasn’t going to do it, but somebody should. But I don’t know that anybody is.
And so now if I were in the room, if I were in the Vice President Harris for president campaign, I would try to slow this down, you know. Honestly, this is what Bill Clinton would describe as a high class problem. So many endorsements coming in so quickly. You want to I think now you want to stagger them. There are some Midwest governors that have not endorsed yet. Walls, Evers, Whitmer, like, you know, hold them back, do something with them, go to their states so that you can show some deliberation in the way that you are earning support of, you know, in different states and maybe of different demographics. You know, the labor unions go out with them, you know, do things so people are seeing that the endorsements are happening for a reason.
It’s not just panic that everybody needs to get on board with whoever the Democratic nominee that they are selecting, that they are choosing to endorse Kamala Harris because of her record as vice president. You know, I know a lot about the labor unions in particular, and they have so much that this administration has done for labor that, you know, they want to endorse her because of that. We want to endorse her because of this and her record. And this is what she’s going to do as president. And also in the lead up between now and the convention, you want that kind of roadmap, I think, that’s building that, you know, now that they’ve gone through the chaos of the first day, I think you want to be more methodical about lining this up. But like, wow, it’s a high class problem.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah. And the most important thing to note here is that no one of substance has surfaced to challenge her, even though they could. You only have to have 300 signatures to become a candidate and no one has. All the people mentioned —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — have either endorsed her or maybe will endorse her over the coming two or three days, every single one. And let me just say this about Joe Manchin. This is a phrase. It’s well-worn, but bless his heart. You know, I mean, lordy. It is just so typical of him that he pokes his head out, like anybody, hey, anybody. Hey, look at me, look at me.
Jennifer Palmieri: It’s just that basic with that guy, isn’t it?
Claire McCaskill: I know.
Jennifer Palmieri: Sometimes I make things more complicated than they need to be. It’s like no peace, he’s just an attention hog. That’s just like what’s going on.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah. And so we know the DNC rules allow for anybody to gather signatures and be placed in nomination. And when they do the roll call, whether it’s virtual, here or, you know, the first weeks of August or whether it’s at the convention, those names can be placed in nomination and the delegates could vote. So, this notion that there is no way anybody has a chance is based more on the practical realities than on the process, because the process certainly allows for anyone to step up if they want to. But, you know, what’s really happening here, Jen, and I think it’s important that we really put an exclamation point behind this. There was such stress. Literally, most Democrats I know had been holding their breath for days. It was like, oh, please, you know, we cannot. This is just untenable. We can’t go on like this. We can’t continue to not know for sure. We can’t continue to wait for a slip up or, you know, a moment where we are revisiting —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — his ability to make the case. And now it’s just like this unbelievable rush of relief.
Jennifer Palmieri: $49.6 million dollars rush of relief. Yeah, I know. So much money they’ve raised.
Claire McCaskill: And people need to know that is not big money, people. That is $25 contributions. That is $50 contributions, maybe $100.
Jennifer Palmieri: Those are my sisters. I heard from so many members of my family, who do I donate to?
Claire McCaskill: Me too. I heard from friends that I’m pretty sure never gave to me that said, how do I give to Kamala Harris? And it was like, okay. Well, I’ll help. So, I think the amount of money that came in from low donors, first of all, I like it because it really puts the big donors in their place. They should be at the back of the parade, not at the front of the parade. And the front of the parade are folks that are showing an outpouring of support for Kamala Harris. And I think that’s very, very, very exciting. And I think now, Jen, if I were in the room, she’s got to spend some money right now, especially in the swing states on a really powerful biography spot.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: Plouffe was saying this morning, I couldn’t agree with him more, you’ve got to do biography. You’ve got to do it serious and you’ve got to do it, sustain it with a lot of weight behind it, both online and in traditional media forums, and then move into the contrast. The media is going to be focused on the contrast and not her bio.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: She’s going to have to let people understand what she has overcome. Every race she’s made in her life, she was underestimated.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: And this is no different. And I love it that she would come at this as an underdog, an underestimated underdog, but a courtroom prosecutor who knows–
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: — how to take it to the witness in a way that I’m not sure we’ve had a presidential candidate be able to do in a long time.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah. I mean, here’s what people need to know. And if you want to shorthand it and help her, prosecutor, attorney general, senator, vice president, president. Like, how’s that for a good resume, people? You know, I think people, because she, you know, has been sort of new in the national scene for the last five years, like that is her resume. By the way, prosecutor, attorney general, the biggest state of the nation, senator, biggest state of the nation. But yeah, agree with that. So like now you have the time. Bio ad, use your endorsements to kind of, you know, slow the endorsement downs, use them to reaffirm things in your bio, what you’ve accomplished to help introduce you. And then, you know, we know prosecutor versus the felon. She’s phenomenal. Like she’s phenomenal on the debate stage. She’s phenomenal in prosecuting an argument on abortion, on democracy, on rights. But you get a few weeks now to introduce yourself and that’s what, yeah, that’s what they should do.
Claire McCaskill: I think everybody needs this lesson. This is what you need to remember. You know, in a sentence, when you put that little half circle there, it’s a comma. It’s Kamala.
Jennifer Palmieri: La.
Claire McCaskill: Kamala.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yes. Because I worked with her sister, Maya, on Hillary’s campaign, that’s what she would say. Kamala.
Claire McCaskill: Yes.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: Kamala. So, yeah, VP, what do you think?
Jennifer Palmieri: Oh my God. I mean, oh boy. Okay. I mean, the auditions on “Morning Joe” were hilarious. Here’s the list that’s like been reported as being vetted. It’s Kentucky Governor Andy Beshear, North Carolina Governor Roy Cooper, Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro, and Senator Mark Kelly of Arizona. I think those are the four most serious that I believe we know are actually being vetted. And what that means, people, is like a team of lawyers descend on you and produce a really scary binder of, you know, anything that they can find out about you. And it’s a very serious, very intense, very uncomfortable process. Other ones that could be, are rumored to be, considering Maryland Governor Wes Moore, California Governor Gavin Newsom. You can’t have two Californians.
I mean, he’s great and obviously you can’t have two Californians. J.B. Pritzker, Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker. He is one of the governors that has not endorsed yet. Like I said, sort of like a swath of Midwest. I forgot about him. Whitmer, Evers, Pritzker, Walls of Minnesota. I think Josh Shapiro is the most serious candidate at this point. You know, if he can lock up Pennsylvania, that’s great. I know labor really likes him. He’s a phenomenal candidate. I’ve interviewed that guy a lot. He’s just like a really good campaigner. Raphael Warnock of Georgia, Gretchen Whitmer. What do you think of the list?
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, I think that’s the list. I think the top four are the ones you mentioned.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: Mark Kelly has a lot to recommend him. His background, he also would help in a state that is important, not as important as Pennsylvania, but nonetheless important.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: I just think there’s a sense in many ways that getting somebody from outside of Washington helps.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah,.
Claire McCaskill: And since Mark is a sitting United States senator, although he doesn’t feel like it. You know what I mean?
Jennifer Palmieri: He doesn’t feel like a senator at all.
Claire McCaskill: Right, right.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: I mean, he feels like a senator, but he feels like what he’s done in his life is bigger —
Jennifer Palmieri: Yes.
Claire McCaskill: — than even maybe being a senator.
Jennifer Palmieri: Did you say he’s an astronaut? Should we remind people of that? Let’s remind people who he is.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah. He was an astronaut, but really flew a lot of combat missions.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: You know, J.D. Vance did PR for the Marines in Iraq. Mark Kelly was in the plane that was being shot at and that was delivering weaponry in the war effort. So a big difference in terms of their backgrounds.
Jennifer Palmieri: And his wife.
Claire McCaskill: And his wife, Gabby Giffords, one of the first real true victims of political violence in our country. Not the only obvious, but in modern times, since the Kennedy assassinations and Martin Luther King, really the first person to be seriously wounded in an assassination attempt. I love Josh Shapiro. I think he’s great.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: I think it’s for a lot of reasons. I think he makes the most sense.
Jennifer Palmieri: Kelly makes a lot of sense, too.
Claire McCaskill: Kelly does, too.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah.
Claire McCaskill: And I don’t mind either Andy Beshear or Roy Cooper.
Jennifer Palmieri: True.
Claire McCaskill: You know what I love? I love the fact that all of the people being talked about have had to run in states that they could lose to a Republican.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah, for sure.
Claire McCaskill: I mean, that’s really important, you guys, because —
Jennifer Palmieri: It is.
Claire McCaskill: — I mean, don’t get me wrong. Kamala Harris has fought maybe the toughest battles you ever fight, which is primary wars in California. But because those primaries in California are brutal —
Jennifer Palmieri: Terrible.
Claire McCaskill: Terrible. But I like the idea that all four of these nominees have had to get votes from people that don’t have a D behind their name. They know what it means to speak to the electorate, not on partisan terms, on terms of what matters to people, what you can do to address the real life problems they have. And I just think all four of these are great choices. I think she’ll be served well by any of them. I give a little bit of a front runner status to Josh Shapiro just because he comes from Pennsylvania.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yeah. And he’s really good. I mean, he is a very effective campaigner. Okay, so money. We talked a little bit about money, but I want to explain something else. The Harris campaign announced this morning that they have raised $49.6 million dollars since Biden dropped out. It’s the biggest fundraising day of the 2024 cycle. The other thing people should know about that’s helpful if the nomination goes to Harris is that because she is on the ticket with Biden, she can assume the infrastructure of the campaign and the resources of the campaign. And that would not have been true for somebody that had not been on the ticket. Let’s take a quick break here and when we come back, I want to nerd out on the DNC rules for nominating Kamala Harris.
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Jennifer Palmieri: Okay, let’s explain the craziness about the timing of the nomination and what those rules are. I’m kind of up to speed on this. Are you up to speed on this? It’s so complicated. Okay.
Claire McCaskill: It’s too boring for me.
Jennifer Palmieri: But it matters a lot. All right. So —
Claire McCaskill: I know. I know.
Jennifer Palmieri: It matters. It matters. It matters. Okay, the convention starts on August 19. The party, the DNC, the Democratic Convention has continued to say that there should be a virtual nomination to have the nomination done sometime between August 1st and August 7th because in order to make sure that the candidate can be on the Ohio ballot, their rule is that they need to know who the nominee is by August 7. Ohio passed a law that said that they would wait. The law doesn’t take effect until September 1. Most lawyers I talk to say that doesn’t matter. You don’t actually need to have the virtual nomination by August 7 in order to worry about Ohio. It’s fine. Some people say it’s risky to not do that. Let’s just assume that it’s fine to not worry about Ohio.
The other problem is that Washington State starts printing. They need to know who the nominee is on August 20. They start printing ballots. Then California starts printing ballots on August 22. The convention starts on August 19. And so what has to get decided in the next week is how the nomination is going to happen. Will they pursue, move forward quickly, like in the next, you know, two weeks from now, I guess, and then that window of August 1 to August 7, and do a virtual nomination of the vice president? Or will they wait, you know, create a rule that allows them to wait and do this actually in Chicago and nominate her there, you know, as you would in a traditional convention?
I think they need to figure this out and like let her have a real nomination and not have a Zoom call, you know. Like figure it out, people. You’re in charge of the rules. Jay Inslee is the governor of Washington. If you need to ask him to like print his ballots a week later, I bet you can figure that out. Let’s have a real convention and, you know, particularly when we’re reintroducing a new nominee to the country.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah, and Mark Elias put out a statement yesterday as the definitive Democratic lawyer saying, do not worry, the Democratic nominee will be on the ballot in all 50 states. There is nothing that can be done to change that. Since Mark has spoken, I am comfortable with that.
Jennifer Palmieri: Me, too.
Claire McCaskill: Let’s do this in a way that gives those double haters, those disengaged voters, those voters that have not been paying attention because it was just two old white guys, let’s speak to them in a way that is meaningful and I think you’re right. I think it’d be better to do it at the convention if they can figure it out.
Jennifer Palmieri: Yes. Do it for real. It’s ridiculous.
Claire McCaskill: By the way, if we’ve figured all this out, surely we can figure that out because it seems a lot less difficult than what we’ve just been through.
Jennifer Palmieri: I mean, also the party controls the party, right? So like I just don’t understand why they can’t, like it’s ridiculous. So anyway. Wow. Okay. I mean, a way different Monday than I expected that we would. You know, we just recorded on Friday.
Claire McCaskill: Yeah. And guess what? We’ll be back on Thursday.
Jennifer Palmieri: We will be back on Thursday. Yes, with Dave Wasserman. I’m super excited about that. He is the analyzer from Cook Political Report, and there’s no one who goes deeper into the data of what’s actually happening in all of these states and districts. So that’ll be great.
So historic day, friends. Thanks so much for listening. As we said, we’ll be back on Thursday for our regular weekly episode. If you have a question for us, this will be good. There’ll be a lot of good questions this week. Send it to howtowinquestions@nbcuni.com, or you can leave us a voicemail at 646-974-4194.
Claire McCaskill: This show is produced by Vicki Vergolina. Janmaris Perez is our associate producer. Catherine Anderson and Bob Mallory are our audio engineers. Our head of audio production is Bryson Barnes. Aisha Turner is the executive producer for MSNBC Audio. And Rebecca Kutler is the senior vice president for content strategy at MSNBC.
Jennifer Palmieri: Search for “How To Win 2024” wherever you get your podcasts and follow the series.